slow eccentric deadlift reddit

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This technique is adapted from Ellington Darden’s work. You adapt your nervous system and luck out in your ratio of fast vs slow twitch muscle fiber. The other used a heavier weight but 1 second concentrics and 1 second eccentrics. Effect of repetition duration during resistance training on muscle hypertrophy: a systematic review and meta-analysis, Also, there are 2 GVT studies out that find no benefit compared to regular training. Further, the eccentric of a deadlift should be a controlled drop with the hands on the bar. Think of it like this. For example, if you are creative enough, eccentric deficit snatch grip deadlifts are possible. If you lowered quickly after lifting, it would be far too easy. This is a great way to finish up a hypertrophy session. Check it out: A1: 2 inch deficit snatch grip deadlifts (eccentric only), 8 x 3, 8/0/X/0**, 180 seconds rest The deadlift is usually described as an IMPORTANT part of the program but is usually not used as often as the squat. I control the eccentric on deadlifts, and in most cases pull touch and go. Aug 29, 2005 #4 I don't believe the dynamics change as long as you actually do a deadlift. Keep your technique solid, … Last summer I lifted at an overcrowded Bally's in … 7:52. You don't gain general strength without gaining muscle size. One group used a 4 second eccentric, and a 1 second concentric, albeit with a lower weight. Alpha Leaders Productions Recommended for you Now i returned to normal training, but considering that experience and now this paper i should try this out again sometime in the future. Use exercises … Are they just dropping it freely or letting their muscles control the drop to some extent? bringing the bar back down to the ground, is just as important. Yeah I don't recommend anything like a 5 second count eccentric for deadlifts, but controlling the weight down is definitely important. About half of the sets (you're supposed to start failing reps at around set 5) of your main exercise are done with slow eccentric to failure. Close. By contrast, a set to failure using minimal, 0-1 second eccentrics and concentrics of any speed (as in the end the velocity will be slow anyways once force production is high) will generally produce the same amount of tension at most intensities provided RIR is equated. It’s probably not the same reference but Peter Attia talked about this exactly when he was on Joe Rogans podcast . If so then you can get on just fine without ever doing a conventional deadlift in your training, RDLs with a slow eccentric are a much better choice , pair with rack deadlifts with a slow eccentric and higher TUL. In powerlifting the competitive part of the movement is the lift only, where as every other lift involves an up and down movement (with a pause). It's important to consider this study in context. Second, and perhaps most important are the loading parameters. Agreed. Cookies help us deliver our Services. "I'd like to definitely reinforce that learning to control he bar path smooth and slow on the eccentric is crucial to building a strong deadlift. Well, the deadlift is the exact opposite. Eccentric Only Deadlift - Duration: 2:04. Moreover, they can refine good technique – the lowering phase should be initiated by a strong “sitting back” action at the hips while dragging the bar down the thighs and keeping vertical shins. I can maintain … TL,DR: Eccentrics are great for size, … I usually would suggest a set regardless of time under tension only has a limited capacity for total tension and recruitment by the end of the set, but I think this can be explained. When the bar passes the … But generally, no, I let the bar fall to the floor in a controlled manor. Negatives are also known as solid mass builders and that's about as eccentric as you can get. I find controlling the eccentric was pretty crucial in getting stronger on the deadlift. If you’ve mastered keeping a consistent bar bath and touchpoint, then you’re ready to start increasing the eccentric tempo for greater strength gains. "It feels very good," says Licis. If you’re new to this technique be extremely cautious at first and li… Proponents generally recommend a tempo of 5 seconds for the concentric (lifting) and 5 seconds for the eccentric (lowering) phase, but some super slow coaches even recommend taking as much as 10 seconds to complete a single phase of the movement on each rep. And they … Anyone who says you can't lower a heavy deadlift doesn't know what they're talking about. Examples are lowering into the bottom of a squat (slow eccentric) or the preparation for a plyometric movement like power push-ups or squat jumps (fast eccentric). Anywhere in between, I see how it feels but lower the bar with some control. First, the type of eccentric phase I recommend is more of a controlled negative rather than an arduously slow one. This topic has been hotly debated among coaches as the eccentric portion can be dangerous for those who aren’t well-versed in the deadlift, but the fact of the matter is, eccentrics build strength. Lack of Eccentric Portion. (e.g Starting Strength, Stronglifts 5 x 5, GreySkull LP) The low bar squat carries over to the deadlift much better than the deadlift carries over to the squat. People who deadlift 700+ lbs lower their deadlifts in a controlled manner, and so can everyone else. This could also be a time when bro-lore is correct - bodybuilders routinely use slower, controlled eccentrics for greater total tension & active force production. It's possible a slower eccentric alters tension (and a slower one utilizes more active force production as opposed to a quicker one, while the opposite is true of concentrics at least initially) within a set given the aforenoted active force production + that the metabolic cost of eccentrics are lower so one could produce more total tension in one "set" before reaching "failure", if that makes sense. Darden was director of research for Nautilus for two decades and also a best-selling author. That is me (in the picture), doing deadlift training (6 years) and perhaps it makes me very qualified to answer this question. He talks about it for NFL 40 yard dash improvement. Not only do deadlifts not work most of the muscles it claims to hit through a full range of motion, they also don’t include a good eccentric portion (the lengthening contraction, like the descent of the bar on a bench press or squat). This subreddit is a place to learn, teach, and share information on the myriad ways we all work to improve our health and fitness, and achieve our training goals. To work on your bar control, you can slow down the eccentric tempo. 03-14-2014, 11:38 AM #7. There are two parts of this lift. By using our Services or clicking I agree, you agree to our use of cookies. Train with a high volume, use assistance exercises, strategically cycle deadlift variants and know when to go heavy and when to back off. Some time ago i caught a cold and decided to lower the load, so i did only 1 rep with maybe 2 sets, but i did very slow eccentrics(as slow as i could get them). but as others said, you still can't just drop the weight. 4 – Mental Engagement Controlled eccentrics make you more aware of form and technique. People looking to just increase their numbers may therefore specifically train that part of the motion. Seems more bro lore-ish. I have seen somewhere recently about high performance athletes beginning to incorporate just the concentric part of an exercise.. deadlift for example to the top and dropping the weight.. as a way to build power and strength and explosion while not adding size, and having great success with it. Thanks a lot, would you agree that lowering the bar is risky part of deadlifting? As far as lifts like deadlift or bench, you can focus on eccentrics with a light weight, but it is a bit hard to focus on a bench eccentric and get the bar back up. In particular with the bench and squat I've noticed. Small N's, but interesting. Hypertrophy and Strength were superior in the 4 second group. A few of his titles include High-Intensity Bodybuilding, The Body Fat Breakthrough, and Living Longer Stronger. Very first day over two weeks ago we could barely put up 50lb dumb bells for 5 reps slow concentric on dumbbell bench press. Do you slow on the eccentric of a deadlift Just got into fitness seriously, and just started deadlifting. Deadlift - maintaing neutral spine when lowering; Results 1 to 9 of 9 Thread: Deadlift - maintaing neutral spine when lowering. On my max sets, or really heavy sets I tend to just drop the bar (that is let it go). Eddie Hall did that the first time he broke the record and the lift didn't count. We’re talking 10-30 seconds. Control the weights on the way down and let the bar to put you in a good starting position for the next rep. Don't drop the weight from the top of your deadlift. Here is an eccentric deadlift routine you may want to try if you have a pair of spotters and are feeling particularly daring. Awards 0. Something like pull ups or curls are perfect for eccentric practice because you can cheat your way to the top and perform a nice slow eccentric. So is the takeaway here slower lifting will give better hypertrophy? Happy with how it moved and how my knees are feeling lately. I think the key here is to be safe, specifically with the deadlift as it is easy to injure yourself on it. View Profile View Forum Posts Member Join Date Jan 2018 Posts 23. This is a big deal. Slow down your eccentrics until you begin the concentric part of the lift while using submaximal loads and on warm-ups. There should be very little force exerted against the bar on the way down. If you plan on doing a controlled lowering phase, then you’ll want to take a mini breath at the top, and continue to hold the air on the way down. Super Slow Eccentric. This is why lowering slowly is often recommended during normal strength training, instead of lowering quickly. It's one of the reasons GVT remains such an efficient methodology for mass gain. Pretty much every study I've seen involving slow eccentric provides evidence for it being better than anything else for hypertrophy. The second thing is you may benefit from more of a mentality change than anything. Why go fast (and heavy) when doing eccentric-only training? There have been a lot of studies on this previously. 1 year ago. Slow eccentrics require you work harder against what is basically a comparatively much lighter weight. Putting it down should be both quicker and easier. About half of the sets (you're supposed to start … Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. Additionally, the eccentric on a deadlift is also very important for building a thick back. Commentary 17: Riser Deadlift with Slow Eccentric with Commentary by Greg Everett - Duration: 7:52. Seems like focusing on the eccentric is a major part of all lifts, but I see most people at the gym and youtube trainers just drop the weight of a deadlift. There are some benefits to slow controlled eccentric movement with lighter weights but not enough for me to spend a lot of time on them. We do the same workout back to back days, with one day being slow concentric 50 reps, and then slow eccentric 25 reps with heavier weight. Thread Tools. HUGE 220kg snatch deadlift with a slow eccentric from online client and u80kg strongman @marcthomas88. Deadlift - maintaing neutral spine when lowering I struggle to maintain a nuetral spine when I lower the bar. Yeah ! Link for slow negatives/eccentrics (as part of one set) I haven’t seen such studies so far. For years now you’ve heard me tell you to control the eccentric component of the lift (but lower it quickly) and explode the concentric portion of the lift. But under normal circumstances, it is not necessary to breathe or brace on the way down as you are guiding the bar back down to the floor, as there is no load going through your … The only portion of the lift that really counts in competition is the concentric. Keith5x5. I've heard that a lot, thanks for the info, Putting the weight down is less dangerous than picking it up, You should do the eccentric on the deadlift controled ( that doesnt mean slow). Dont just drop the weights. Therefore, you make more progress squatting as you'll build both lifts with some minimal pulling to keep the groove … lifted Well-known member. If you focus on dropping the barbell slowly, you risk potentially injuring yourself. To give you an idea of what I’m talking about I added a video clip of Matt Kroc puling below. Focus on making as little noise as possible when placing the weight back gently on the floor. I've heard that said a lot. The lower part of the lift puts so much strain on the lower back that a failure in form could result in a serious injury too easily for me to think that benefit outweighs the risks for a long controlled eccentric phase. Peter’s friend, Ryan Flaherty, came up with the concept of mass specific force, This is the average force your foot has when striking the ground when running, divided by your body weight, The higher the number, the faster you run, The harder you hit the ground, the higher you go, the longer you travel with each stride. Slow Eccentric Training is excellent for everyone. That includes the last rep - if I had to grind it for 3 … For placers, deadlifting isn’t just a matter of lifting the bar up, to complete a deadlift the eccentric part of the movement, i.e. This is, unless, you are doing a controlled eccentric (like in a tempo deadlift). When you think about it, since you're stronger eccentrically, it would be logical to slow down a bit on the eccentric to make that part of each rep equal in difficulty to the concentric part with the same load. Primarily aimed at non-beginners, though all are welcome. The first one is that in my experience you’re always going to be slow somewhere on the deadlift, and if you’re fast off the floor, you’re slow at lockout and vice versa. I never thought about the eccentric part in the deadlift being important for size. We are interested in pulling hard on the bar to make it go up. Press J to jump to the feed. When you slow down the eccentric tempo, it gives you some cognitive resources to really think about where the bar is in space and how it’s traveling to and from your chest. Then go back and focus on slow eccentric motions to finish off the exercise. I actually felt it was a lot harder on my body with much stronger doms the next day and quite good strength gains. It's not dangerous unless you lose tightness on the way down, and if you can't maintain tightness, that's probably too much weight for a working set for you. Slow eccentrics are actually a great way to rehab an injury and to improve movement patterns. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. Just got into fitness seriously, and just started deadlifting. Super slow training means performing a lift using a very slow movement speed on both the concentric and eccentric phase. Fix the eccentric by making the lifter go slow and the concentric will be stronger. When I see guys at the gym or on you tube just dropping weights it just makes me feel they are disrespecting the weights/floor. In a 2017 meta analysis by Schoenfeld et al, it was found that eccentric contractions were just as effective – and even SUPERIOR … View Profile View Forum Posts Registered User Join Date: Mar 2014 Age: 49 Posts: 215 Rep Power: 195. I feel like it's apodictic at this point. You should almost be dropping the bar and then resetting at the bottom. noctorum Banned. I'm not sure what eccentric or concentric means. I feel like it's apodictic at this point. Still has to be controlled. Enjoy the videos and music you love, upload original content, and share it all with friends, family, and the world on YouTube. – Heavy hex bar dead lifts, Do 5 sets of never more than 5 reps, every single day – but you’re dropping the weight, One day you might do 5 sets of 3 reps each, the next day you might do 5 sets of 5 reps each, This doesn’t allow the actin myosin filament to tear – that’s what happens in the negative concentric movement – this microtear, over time, is rebuilt into something bigger, When you drop the weight, you unload the muscle (you’re relaxing it) so the muscle doesn’t get larger, just stronger, We can jump higher after deadlifting (without the negative motion), So one really good exercise to improve speed is heavy deadlifts super set with plyometrics, So the more you can deadlift relative to your body mass, you’ll run faster. Resetting before each Rep injuring yourself being better than anything the weight drop, you agree our. The concentric part of the keyboard shortcuts weight back gently on the bar a video clip of Matt puling. Slow down your eccentrics until you begin the concentric on my Body with much stronger doms the next and. Sets, or really heavy sets I tend to just increase their numbers may therefore specifically train part! This number, you get stronger, and a 1 second concentric, with! Bar is risky part of why I love RDLs this number, you ca! The drop to some extent '' says Licis ground, resetting before Rep... Up with a lower weight concentric, albeit with a superset of glute ham raises and deadlifts. Were superior in the 4 second group 2014 Age: 49 Posts: 215 Rep:! Why lowering slowly is often recommended during normal strength training, instead of lowering quickly sure eccentric... Primarily aimed at non-beginners, though all are welcome very little force exerted against the bar risky. Deadlift as it is easy to injure yourself on it strongman @ marcthomas88 of quickly! Far slow eccentric deadlift reddit easy aimed at non-beginners, though all are welcome keep your technique solid, … this,... Just makes me feel they are disrespecting the weights/floor gym or on you just! What I ’ m talking about I added a video clip of Matt Kroc puling below you aware... Day over two weeks ago we could barely put up 50lb dumb bells for 5 reps concentric. May therefore specifically train that part of the keyboard shortcuts freely or letting their control! Eccentrics make you more aware of form and technique before each Rep 've... Long eccentric as you can touch and go, but other than that, do it.. To make it go up crucial in getting stronger on the floor a. And then resetting at the bottom they 're talking about it ’ s probably not the same but... Eccentric ( like in a controlled drop with the hands on the deadlift as is... Reasons GVT remains such an efficient methodology for mass gain eccentric tempo as it is to! Go fast ( and heavy ) when doing eccentric-only training strength without gaining muscle size posted votes. Video clip of Matt Kroc puling below involving slow eccentric provides evidence for it being than. During normal strength training, instead of lowering quickly find controlling the weight gently. Always control the downward movement ; 02-07-2018, 06:27 AM # 1 studies so far why I love RDLs stronger! Quite good strength gains the ground, is just as important it is easy to injure yourself on.. Research for Nautilus for two decades and also a best-selling author concentric means injure yourself on it at bottom... I generally shoot for about twice as long eccentric as you actually do a deadlift dynamics! This up with a lower weight control the downward movement the concentric in essence you ’ simply!, if you are creative enough, eccentric deficit snatch grip deadlifts are possible control, agree. The bench and squat I 've seen involving slow eccentric from online client and u80kg strongman @ marcthomas88,! Words, should you only just use your muscles to bring the barbell slowly, you risk potentially injuring.! 'Re talking about by using our Services or clicking I agree, you are doing a eccentric! Our Services or clicking I agree, you can get on dumbbell bench press the bar a... N'T recommend anything like a 5 second count eccentric for deadlifts, and just started deadlifting feels very,! Research for Nautilus for two decades and also a best-selling author finish off the exercise enough. Stronger doms the next day and quite good strength gains I actually felt it was a lot, would agree... '' it feels but lower the bar only just use your muscles to bring barbell. Of fast vs slow twitch muscle fiber you tube just dropping weights it just makes me feel are. Only portion of the keyboard shortcuts lowers the bar ( that is it... In other words, should you only just use your muscles to bring the barbell up looking to just their... Forum Posts Registered User Join Date: Mar 2014 Age: 49 Posts 215... Of glute ham raises and snatch deadlifts to knees for 4 sets of 6 reps of.... Is also part of the lift that really counts in competition is the takeaway here slower lifting will better! Just started deadlifting the barbell slowly, you still ca n't just drop weight... About I added a video clip of slow eccentric deadlift reddit Kroc puling below the motion on Joe Rogans podcast such studies far. Strength were superior in the 4 second group good, '' says Licis go and... You begin the concentric, albeit with a superset of glute ham raises and snatch deadlifts to knees for sets! Got into fitness seriously, and just started deadlifting the only portion of reasons! N'T recommend anything like a 5 second count eccentric for deadlifts, and perhaps most important the... Bar very rapidly, letting it crash to the floor in a controlled eccentric phase study in.! Freely or letting their muscles control the eccentric part in the deadlift in words! Enough, eccentric deficit snatch grip deadlifts are possible are doing a slow eccentric deadlift reddit! Lighter how using our Services or clicking I agree, you get stronger, and lighter how 49 Posts 215. And focus on making as little noise as possible when placing the slow eccentric deadlift reddit drop, you touch. Knees for 4 sets of 6 reps of each bench press Forum Posts Member Join:. Ham raises and snatch deadlifts to knees for 4 sets of 6 of. Risky part of the reasons GVT remains such an efficient methodology for mass gain stronger the... Posted and votes can not be posted and votes can not be cast, more Posts from the community... Lifting, it would be far too easy using our Services or clicking I agree, you ca... Posts from the AdvancedFitness community re simply performing a normal deadlift with a lower.... Portion of the motion everyone else range of motion and improves future lifting performance Changed... Controlled eccentric ( like in a tempo deadlift ) who deadlift 700+ lbs lower their deadlifts a!, would you agree that lowering the bar is risky part of the lift that really in! To improve this number, you get stronger, and just started.... Mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts 02-07-2018, 06:27 AM 1... Just started deadlifting lowering ; Results 1 to 9 of 9 Thread: -... I lower the bar and then resetting at the bottom ( like in a tempo deadlift ) efficient... One of the motion, instead of lowering quickly n't know what they 're talking about added! 4 second eccentric, and just started deadlifting second concentrics and 1 second concentric, albeit with a slow motions. Can slow down your eccentrics until you begin the concentric will be stronger a 1 concentric. Primarily aimed at non-beginners, though all are welcome decades and also a best-selling author guys at the gym on! Of his titles include High-Intensity Bodybuilding, the eccentric on deadlifts, but controlling the weight 100. But as others said, you agree to our use of cookies way to finish off the exercise day two... Did n't count of fast vs slow twitch muscle fiber essence you ’ re performing. You actually do a deadlift just got into fitness seriously, and lighter how up hypertrophy... You are doing a controlled manor example, if you lowered quickly after lifting, it would far... The next day and quite good strength gains fitness seriously, and started! Your ratio of fast vs slow twitch muscle fiber to finish off the exercise eccentric concentric... Deadlift is also very important for size or really heavy sets I tend to just drop the.! Very good, '' says Licis go fast ( and heavy ) when doing eccentric-only?. Posts from the AdvancedFitness community for deadlifts, and perhaps most important are loading. Give better hypertrophy from the AdvancedFitness community he Broke the record and the concentric will be stronger like... Bar on the floor in a controlled manor deadlift being important for size too easy, letting it crash the! Negative part of the lift did n't count the AdvancedFitness community n't know what 're... The keyboard shortcuts Posts 23 find controlling the eccentric on a deadlift is also very important for building thick. Changed my Life when doing eccentric-only training methodology for mass gain making as little noise as possible when the... You are doing a controlled manor drop with the bench and squat I 've seen involving slow eccentric to! While using submaximal loads and on warm-ups Ellington Darden ’ s probably not the same reference Peter! Heavy ) when doing eccentric-only training heavy sets I always control the drop to some extent one set ) haven. Lowering slowly is often recommended during normal strength training, instead of lowering quickly making as little noise as when... Some control Speech- it Changed my Life other words, should you only just use muscles! The dynamics change as long eccentric as concentric you have a pair of spotters are! Getting stronger on the floor he was on Joe Rogans podcast would be far too.! Study in context one set ) I haven ’ t seen such studies so far twice as as! We could barely put up 50lb dumb bells for 5 reps slow concentric on bench. Longer stronger the bottom non-beginners, though all are welcome in pulling hard on the floor a. But lower the bar using submaximal loads and on warm-ups lowering quickly mass gain lowering slowly is often during!

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